VMs: RE: VMS numbering systems hypotheses...

["GC" <glenclaston@xxxxxxxxx>]

> Interesting! Do you have a reference or starting point
> you could direct me
> to on this? More or less all of my astrological
> readings (for the period
> circa 1500) have focused on the Ficino-vs-fatalist debate - a
> political/heretical position, basically - and Padua has
> slipped beneath my
> radar, thanks. :-)

As to the astrological end of things, one has to look to Sacro
Bosco (John of Hollywood).  Apparently his belief in what - the
12th century??? that the world was round led to his resurrection
post 1492.  Sacro Bosco's preoccupation with incorporating Hebrew
(or is this an addition by later transcribers?) set his work up to
be incorporated into a "holistic" study that included cabalistic
mathematics and Bosco astrology/astronomy schemes.  Some
pre-history is certainly in order here.

Understand to begin with that the medieval mind sought what we now
seek, the Unifying Field Theory, only their search was based on
the "fact" that Hebrew was the oldest language and fully ordained
by God, therefore all other languages stemmed from that language.
The Babel incident confused these languages, but very intuitive
scholars discerned that there was a pattern to the diffusion, and
sought to reunify the languages, or at least the alphabets.  So
many ancient records exist that define the written word as an
element of extreme power that this reunification attempt was
inevitable.  I remember you saying that you were trying to decide
which side of the coin the images fell on, magic or astrology, but
if we're really looking at something created somewhere slightly
before or after 1500, the line may be virtually non-existent in
the mind of the author.  Invisible powers and influences exist,
they have an affect on everything of matter, and knowing these
powers and guiding them was the goal of these arts.

In this vein, the stars impart power to the earth, to plants,
animals, and man.  These powers affect virtually everything that
happens.  Remember that the old argument of pre-ordained vs/choice
was pretty much decided by the astrologers and "magicians"
(mathematicians) as settled on the side of "pre-ordained".  If
there were full choice, the stars had no influence, but since the
stars are so heavily used to predict and to diagnose, in medicine,
love, study, travel, etc, "choice" is not an option that enters
the mind of the medieval astrologer.  Go against the stars at your
own risk and peril.  That being said, there were several schools
of thought on the matter.  The Ptolemaic view, the Bosco view, in
fact there are some 7 others I could list of importance that may
or may not have some influence on the VMS.  Ptolemy was the
accepted mainstream Catholic view, and even when an author
expressed conflicting methodologies, he usually attributed it to
Ptolemy to cover his backside.  This does get confusing. :-(

Anyway, we see the rise of cabalistic research in some minor
papers around 1470, but hints of it in Alberti around 1450 (though
apparently his work was not actually published until 1468).  Next
is Trithemius, circa 1500 (though clearly fully developed before
that time), followed by Reuchlin in 1517 and the circulation of
Agrippa's manuscripts on the subject around this time.  By 1535,
Agrippa's work was widely circulated in manuscript and adopted in
group study and discussion in Padua, where Agrippa held a chair
until his death.  (An interesting side note is that John Dee must
have been exposed to, and influenced by, this heat of interest in
Agrippa during his stay at Padua.)  Heated interest in Reuchlin is
also evident elsewhere.

Agrippa is a key figure, in that he claimed to be a student of
Trithemius.  I sometimes wonder who was the student and the
teacher, but far be it from me to doubt the claims of such a man
as Henry Cornelius Agrippa.  I do wonder however what influence
Agrippa was on Reuchlin.?., whose works strongly influenced Blaise
deVigenere.  (There are of course works in Hebrew around this time
that I cannot read, so I don't know their connection.  All three
of the above-mentioned men, as well as Trithemius, were apparently
very good with Hebrew.)

In Agrippa, the end of Book 2 if I recollect, you'll find an
alphabet equivalent for Hebrew, Greek, Latin, and astrological
signs.  This is of course the key to understanding Agrippa, the
angelic names, and the verbose cipher used throughout his text.
This alphabet starts with "B", and the first 17 characters are the
consonants in the various languages.  Spirituals and aspirants
make up the vowels, in the order "aeiov".  Note that John Dee
changed this order for his own use as IEOVA, in the Monas, fully
capitalized as a clear indication that he was aware of the
consonant/vowel division in cabalistic alphabetical
interpretation.

Any further discussion of this matter for those interested might
be better served off the list, as this is probably an off-topic
discussion.  Nevertheless, I hope I have given you some starting
points and some insight into the mind of someone who would create
something like the VMS.

> I'd agree that the herbal is very much clearer - though
> I'd vote the "poem"
> page (f81r) probably the most openly structured page in
> the VMS. :-)

I'll certainly double-check my transcription of this page.  The
real problem with the herbal section is the lack of voluminous
contiguous text.  Maybe I'll get lucky.

> >Pre-polyalphabetic times would put it somewhere before
> 1450 IMHO.
>
> Absolutely? Yes. Relatively? Probably not. The history
> of ideas is the
> history of the *flow* of ideas, which is far from c (in
> the Einsteinian
> sense). :-)

Really?  To find only three examples of the Knight's Tour Cipher
pre-1900 would tend to say it was hardly used, but wait.... two of
the three examples are from the same "group" although centuries
apart, and the third is the Arabic document that probably
originated the idea.  Is it possible to keep a cipher secret for
centuries?  You tell me, you're English and these are English
groups that appear to be perpetuating this phenomenon.  The 1623
example of the Knight's Tour cipher is mine alone, otherwise there
would be only two - hardly a history - and to think this has
hidden under the noses of millions of readers for 4
centuries........ That's a really good cipher!  Is there any
wonder you have little to read on Steganography?  Only the weak
ones seem to be written about, the rest are yet to be discovered.
I truly love my avocation!!!!!!

> Far from it, as I agree with a lot of what you say:
> instead, I pretty much
> rule the possibility out on *statistical* grounds, not
> historical grounds:
> polyalpha (as was understood then and now) would give a
> very much flatter
> distribution than we see in the VMS.

The key phrase "as understood then and now" I fully object to.  We
naturally assume that the purpose of cipher is to create greater
entropy, when in fact it can be used to produce extremely low
entropy.  This idea has been tested a few times in the past, with
the result that very low entropy can be produced by polyalphabetic
means if the 21st century mindset is abandoned.  To me the
question is not whether this came from an holistic mindset, but
rather more toward what factors are used in consideration of this
holistic approach.  We think far too divisive, and never seem to
consider an holistic or inclusive mind, meaning that as long as we
refuse to alter our thinking, we can never understand the
viewpoint of our ancient astrologer/physician.

> >And while the English are without a doubt the worst
> cooks in the
> >world,
>
> You obviously haven't had one of my pizzas! :-)

I was speaking of course from the standpoint of more than 500
years of literature (and ridicule) on the subject of English
cooks.  Also, as an avid watcher of the Food Network, I find that
the ridicule of English cuisine has not been quelled by time.  I'm
sure you personally make a very fine pizza, but the goal here
appears to be that one not Make the pizza, rather consume it.  Are
you too offering a pizza to the winner?  I do have quite an
appetite! :-)

> So many people talk about steganography - and as a
> Bacon enthusiast, with
> good reason :-) - yet I can find so little to read on
> it pre-1550.
> :-(  Similarly for transposition ciphers. :-(

I share in your lament, hence my own personal research.  I'll clue
you in to Bacon research - only two books are of interest, both
post-fall for Lord Bacon.  (I own originals of all of them, so I'm
positive about this).  The biliteral cipher exists in only two
books, the first of which is the Latin version "De Augmentis",
London edition, 1623.  This will lead you to the second, published
"overseas". (No real ground-breaking secrets there however).  It
raises its head only one other time, in a book entitled "Mercury,
the Swift and Secret Messenger".  (Only two pages here, at the
beginning, a simple exercise).  [A brief use in a Rosicrucian
manuscript, but Bacon was not a Rosicrucian, so this is simple
plagiarism].

Of great interest for various cipher usages is the publication by
Rawley on Bacon's death, entitled "Manes Verulamiani".  Brush up
on "Templarian" - not the "Knights Templar", rather the age-old
ciphers used by the lawyers in the various "Temples" of legalism
in England, who also referred to themselves as "Templars".  Any
Bacon enthusiast would digest these hints and make good on them.
(Don't forget Bacon's association with the "Virginia Company", and
his obvious hand in the construction of John Smith's early
pamphlets).  Queen's child?  I doubt it very much.  Founder of the
Rosicrucians?  Not a chance.  FreeMason?  Yes, because he King was
the figurehead of this organization, but court records from
Scotland and England demonstrate that the Freemasons were still
primarily concerned with their trade, which was the carving of
columns, gargoyles, ie, stone carving, and had not fully developed
into a "secret society" by this time.  Fortunately for me I accept
Bacon as an early visionary and scientist.

Your lament about available information on steganography I can
appreciate.  In manuscript I doubt I could ever detect it without
first knowing of its existence, but in print the hints are usually
very clear to the "initiate", and several examples do exist.  Take
Timothy Bright's (wrong author attribution) "Anatomy of
Melancholy" as an example.  It was really meant as a parlor
exercise, and if one works it out, the true author is revealed and
the irony understood.  There are in fact 5 books to my knowledge
published around this time that are in fact "parlor exercises",
exercises in hidden meaning and steganography.  This is very
telling as to how popular and common this method of communication
was to a select group of elitists and scholars.  Why would anybody
expose this type of steganography in writing and ruin it for the
rest of the folks that really enjoyed the exercise?  As to why
examples of truly secret communication have never been exposed,
well... they are secrets, so you have to figure them out!

> BTW, both unbrokenciphers.com and unbrokencodes.com are
> free. :-)

Not a chance!  The beauty of most of these is that they are
steganographically concealed.  To remove that layer and expose the
cipher is a disservice to those who practice this as an art.  An
autopsy on the living, if you will.

GC