RE: VMs: [ha] [hb] not different languages

["GC" <glenclaston@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Rene wrote:

> Like many other things, I am really not sure.
> If the VMs is encoded using some kind of numbering
> scheme, then both the classifications language
> and dialect are misnomers. But it is always easy
> to compare with languages. For example, Spanish
> and Portuguese would differ more from each other
> than HA and HB language. OTOH, written
> British and American English would be closer to
> each other than HA and HB. (This requires a
> proper metric, but I think people understand
> what I mean). And I don't mean to imply that
> British and American English are two dialects :-)

According to Oxford's, our languages were at one time divergent.  With the
advent of worldwide television and the internet, we're presently converging.
Unfortunately, Oxford English will be the loser, y'all! :-)  (Does this mean
I'll never again have an English girl beckon me with sincerity to "Come
knock me up tomorrow"? - the world suffers such losses.) :-)

> > Again I offer the challenge to anyone to find a
> > repetitive difference between the two "hands".
>
> It would require an expert.
> The only expert opinion we have is that it is by
> one and the same person. Currier thought differently,
> but he admitted that he's no expert.

There are handwriting experts that have been on TV, that work for the FBI
and other agencies.  If anybody has a name or two, I'd be happy to make
contact and see if they'd participate for purely scientific purposes.  The
BBC might even know of a few from Scotland Yard or such, that would be
interested, Nick, is that an angle you're interested in?  Maybe we can get a
few more expert opinions?

> > Of the 25% of words exlusive to [ha] or [hb], all
> > you need do is write a
> > computer program to systematically change endings
> > based on the beginning of
> > the word, and you can produce [hb] pages from [ha],
> > or otherwise.  That's
> > not a "dialect" in any sense I understand the term.
>
> It is a very interesting statement you are making
> here.
> It does require a demonstration of course,
> or a counter-example, but this effort will
> certainly lead to new insights.
> At the same time, changing HA-words into HB
> words will not make HA language into HB language,
> in the Currier sense of the word.
> How about introducing another acronym here:
> CL for Currier Language. This acronym is
> suggestive of class or classification, which is
> also quite appropriate.


I'm interested in the CL classification.  How do we use it in place of HA or
HB, or it is a general classification?

> Anyway, word frequencies (word-initial character
> sequences) are not the same in HA and HB, and
> also different in other areas. Still: very,
> very interesting indeed.

I've posted two listings in an earlier post, one a forward and the other a
reverse sort.  These are
http://voynich.info/vgbt/xcrptn/ALLWORDS.pdf and
http://voynich.info/vgbt/xcrptn/ALWDSRVS.pdf

It was looking at these that I finally deduced that a replacement algorithm
would balance most statistics between the two sets, and offer other
explanations for those outstanding.  I'm still in the process of testing
this theory and systematically outlining the replacements, but so far they
all hold to simple rules.  If I had to start throwing in complications I'd
back off, but so far I haven't had to do anything other than simple
replacement to balance statistical data.  News as it happens.

> > The differences between the two are not that
> > numerous, and through a little
> > study they can all be matched up.  What's
> > interesting is that for every
> > ending in [hb], there seem to be at least two
> > endings in [ha] that match up.
> > The assumption that [hb] is a later language comes
> > to mind, given the order
> > of the folio presentation, which would make this
> > situation an "adaptation"
> > on the part of the author.  In [hb] for instance,
> > c89 occurs 333 out of 335
> > times.

> It is very frequent, but there is also the
> distinction between c89 and cc89 (many words
> differ only by that much).

You'll readily see that "cc89" and "c89" are both HB constructs.  They have
counter constructs in HA pages however.  This is the point.

> > Pages of raw data and evidentiary conclusions will
> > be forthcoming, in an
> > imagery I can deal with apart from the text base of
> > this list.
>
> Looking forward, though 'pages of raw data' may
> be hard to digest...

Actually, the two files referenced above are page numbered, and are the only
raw data I need to offer, aside from the fact that they're useful tools.
The word database has already been posted, from which these lists were
generated.

> Another valiant attempt to eradicate a misnomer
> or correct outdated information for once and
> forever!
> There will be future books about the
> Voynich MS where Marci is called Rudolph's
> physician (and one day I will learn to spell
> the emperor's name correctly :-) ) and the
> legendary author of the Voynich MS will still be
> called Francis Bacon.
> We can only keep trying.

Actually, I think the concept "keep trying" is a futile effort here.  Like
you, I'll define my own presentation terms for clarity, and if they catch,
so be it.  If they're ignored, we know who reads and who doesn't!  :-)  In
the end, the views differ so widely that no two people can be brought
together under a single phylosophy, which means the solver will be a
"loner".  I qualify in that regard.

GC

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