RE: Papke project (was VMs: Michelangelo "code")

[Rene Zandbergen <r_zandbergen@xxxxxxxxx>]

Hello Jona and all,

reasonable discussion about why the proposed
solution of Papke and Weydemann may or may not
be correct is very welcome on this list. This
is what this list is all about. 

What I have seen from the various people in
favour of this solution, however, are statements
like:
- you did not study the CD so you have no valid
  argument
- you just cannot accept that someone else
  has found the solution (taken your toy away)
- you criticise me! What gives you the right to
  control opinion on this mailing list?
- you call someone 'Watsisname' so you are a 
  racist
Reasonable discussion between humans naturally
include emotions, so we should not disallow that.
There are good emotions and bad emotions and 
we should of course restrict the second category
as much as possible.

Perhaps someone felt offended by the example
involving the translation of the Voynich MS
according to Tolkien. It was an example of 
parody, and served the purpose of showing that,
if the VMs is to be understood in this manner
(expanding single letters to words or concepts),
there is an almost unlimited number of possible
translations. You can therefore not prove that
one particular solution is the right one.

I have no problem that Ms. Papke holds seminars
that teach people spiritual techniques to
improve aspects of their lives. At the same time
I think that it is misleading that these same people
are led to believe that the Voynich MS has 
anything to do with it.

I've had some E-mail exchanges with Ms.Papke,
each one of them a pleasant exchange of opinion.
My understanding is that she is not too concerned
whether the people on this list believe or 
understand her solution.

Kind regards, Rene Zandbergen

--- jona b stulz <jonabstulz@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Well, I am glad we a agree. 
> That's exactly what I meant.
> Jona
> 
> --- Philip Neal <philipneal_vms@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> > >From: jona b stulz <jonabstulz@xxxxxxxxx>
> > 
> > >What surprised me though was that expressing my
> > >(obvious) positive oppinion (well, I kinda have
> to
> > be
> > >positive...I signed up for it - whether deluded
> or
> > >not)could make other people feel offended. I was
> > not
> > >aware that this subject would have the potential
> to
> > >stir up so much ...
> > 
> > >Therefore I came to the realization that this
> forum
> > >probably isn't the right place to discuss issues
> of
> > >the ms408 project. Therefore, I will be using the
> > >ms408 forum for this particular purpose.
> > 
> > Thank you.
> > 
> > It is fairly evident that Papke and Weydemann
> claim
> > that the Voynich 
> > manuscript is a kind of I Ching consisting of
> > mystical symbols from which 
> > spiritual truth can be derived. Discussion of
> > 'issues of the ms408 project' 
> > will presumably be discussion of alleged spiritual
> > truth of this kind. I 
> > think that protracted discussion on those lines
> > would be very unwelcome to 
> > the great majority of list members, including
> > myself, who regard the 
> > manuscript as a mystery to be explained rather
> than
> > an oracle to be 
> > consulted.
> > 
> > Philip Neal
> > 
> > 
> >
>
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> > 
> 
> 
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