On folio 1r

Ideas relating to possible methods and systems for the translation of the Voynich text.
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All ideas are welcome, but please be civil with each other.
mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

I tried using the signature for a key. There are 213 letters counting the apostrophy and asterick or smudge. 213-9=204 and 17x12=204.
There are 9 letters in the signature, so I made the odd numbered letters of the 17 per line add to the key.
The first line is;

FACH YSYK ALAR ATAI I
Y-D-A-R-A-I-S-H-Y
EAGH ZSQK BLJR TTII H

NSHO LSHO RYCT HRCS Y
Y-D-A-R-A-I-S-H-Y
MSLO MSZO SYLT ARKS X

Later, I figured out that this line could spell Voynich by adding it to Wilfrid.

WILFRID
VOYNICH
SXMTALL
So I think it could be ,
SM SXMTALL
W M Voynich with OSZOYRKS left over?

mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

Continuing on;
I play bass, so I saw a musical idea.
The signature "YDARAISHY" could be a scale.
Key note, Do, Fa, Re, La, Mi, Sol, Thi, Key note.
Then the 17x12 block could be someone playing piano scales.

C,C,D,E,F,G,A,B,CC,B,A,G,F,E,D,C
C#,C#,D#,F,F#,G#A#,C,C#,C#,C,A#,G#,F#F,D#,C#.
D
D#
E
F
F#
G
G#
A
A#
B

It doesn't do anything in English, So you can try other languages with this.
Thanks

mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

This actually came from a dream and who am I to question a dream?

For the "signature" ydaraishy, I got the solution (from the dedication on a Shakespeare poem)

Your Honor's In All Duty,
S(un) RAY

I like it! There are a couple sun faces in there.

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proto57
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:13 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by proto57 »

Hi Mark: Sorry I haven't responded to your ideas lately... although I've been reading and attempting to follow them.

I do understand some of what you have done, I think. But I worry that it is so "hit or miss" that it might take you a "few million years to infinity" to happen to hit on the right plaintext and combinations that are being used.

And also, I was not sure which transcription you are using for this... or maybe I missed that, or forgot. There are also a million different ways to transcribe the Voynich, at least... so again I compound my worry because even if you guessed at a plaintext string to pop in there, there is no saying the transcription you are matching that plaintext to is the correct one.

I hope I haven't misunderstood what you are trying here...

All the best,
Rich.
"Man is the measure of all things: What is, that it is; what is not, that it is not"- Protagoras

mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

Hi Rich,
I am using the same EVA from page 245 of Kennedy and Churchill's book "courtesy of G. Landini"
I agree it's too hit and miss but I found something finally.
I took the 204 letters before the signature and tried first letter-last letter, second letter-second to last etc.
and found Alpha Carina in the second row of 17. Here's the whole thing if you can see anything else.

fnai ciha yhsf yckr a
ALHA PRCA NtIA iiai h
ntsc hroa lesh hcoy r
koon risi haot lodn y
isio ardy rc*h atha t
rcoy rtyo klao irrr c
ohet taoi yien eskh o
anri airo e'co tahs a
nric itah raar ddsa e
nhst ycay iria rosh h
etkc ydoo rhys knai i

If I don't find anything substantial, I won't post it. As this little bit could be a freak!

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proto57
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Re: On folio 1r

Post by proto57 »

Hi Mark: I see then...

Well just to make it clear, although you are probably aware of this already: There is no intended nor known relationship between the Voynich characters, and the Latin letters and Arabic numbers chosen for them, in any transcription.

These transcription characters are only used as a convenience for the purposes of ease of sharing characters online; and analyzing by counting and various other processing by computer.

That is, if a gallows is, for instance, designated by a capital "K", it does not mean that transcriber believes the gallows is the letter "K". Yes, they usually choose the transcription character that has a close look to the Voynich character, but again only as a convenience... like a memory aid. It is easier to remember an associated Latin character if it has a resemblance to the Voynich character.

This even follows for Voynich characters that are almost exactly the same as Latin letters, such as a, c, m, etc.. Usually a Latin "a" is chosen for the Voynichese character which looks like a Latin "a", but it is not intended by the transcriber to be a Latin "a". It is still a Voynich character of unknown value.

Anyway, it probably went without saying, but just in case, and for anyone new who was unaware...

Rich.
"Man is the measure of all things: What is, that it is; what is not, that it is not"- Protagoras

mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

I missed a row;

FNAI CIHA YHSF YCKR A
ALHAPRCA NTIA IIAI H
NTSC HROA LESH HCOY R
RYIC ATSH NRAC KSOY R
KOON RISI HAOT LODN Y
ISIO ARDY RC*H ATHA T
RCOY RTYO KLAO IRRR C
OHET TAOI YIEN ESKH O
ANRI AIRO E'CO TAHS A
NRIC ITAH RAAR DDSA E
NHST YCAY IRIA ROSH H
ETKC YDOO RHYS KNAI I

OK That's 12 lines. My problem is that the left and far right line down seems to have a bad joke ? Anne Frank and Harry Taco ?
accidental words is one thing but jokes are another?

mark097
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:47 pm

Re: On folio 1r

Post by mark097 »

Rich
Please bear with me;

The possible "Alpha Carina" is important because it's common name is Canopus, the rudder of the ship Argo Navis.
Canopus is a city at the mouth of the Nile.
The name means at least to Strabo per Allen's book "but, of yesterday" I think that would mean everything eventually flows past the rudder.
The Canoptic jars are derived from the same word, which were buried in the pyramids.
Theriac jars are in drawings in the book.
"Harry taco" could be Harry octahe(dron). This goes to Page 57v, the "key".
There are 4 people around the top half of a octahedron, or double pyramid.
Around the 4 sides of the text, are 4 names.
I think they are one 4 letter name for the top and one 4 letter name for the hidden bottom.
The top row has ( not in order) Ifan (the "f's" being Russian phi's.) Fski.
Ivan Klecevski was an assumed name of W. Voynich.
The left one Would be Anne (Fremantle) Rain.
The bottom would be Ethy Niak from Ethel Voynich and her idle Stepniak.
The 4th side of the pyramid would be Harry but I don't know who that would be.
So the question is "who is buried in the pyramid?"
Thanks!

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