Re: Why not Dee

["Rafal T. Prinke" <rafalp@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Rene Zandbergen wrote:

> [...] according to the above, the book in hieroglyphics is clearly
> the book of St. Dunstan, according to the tradition of Kelly's discovery
> of it. If this was in Welsh, (also following tradition) Arthur may well 
> have considered these to be hieroglyphics. And maybe Dee *could* read it
> (since Arthur is not making any statement about this).

But wasn't Welsh using Latin alphabet? Dee had books in Greek and Hebrew
which would certainly appear more "curious" to a boy who is just
learning
to read. I think, however, that the key to this recollection of Arthur 
Dee (via Browne) is the usage of the word "hieroglyphics". I feel
(but am not sure) it would not be used for a script-like (VMS) alphabet.
It certainly better fits John Dee's description of another of his books:
"the boke called Angelicum Opus, all in pictures of the work from 
the beginning to the end" which was burnt along with other alchemical
books on Dec. 12th [1587] when Kelley overthrew a lamp. And indeed 
"his father bestowed much time upon" in order to make more "silver
quoits"
for little Arthur to play :-)

> The MS on which the statement was based is clearly identified in
> the Yale catalogue entry:
> 
> > (we thank A. G. Watson for confirming this identification through a
> > comparison of the Arabic numerals in the Beinecke manuscript with
> > those of John Dee in Oxford, Bodleian Library Ashmole 1790, f. 9v,
> > and Ashmole 487)
> 
> Right now I cannot access Rafal's page, so I cannot check if this is
> what he used....

I used the 1583 book catalog page reproduced in Yates's _Theatre of
the World_ which is British Library: Harley 1879. Those used by Watson
are: "Prefatio Latina in actionem" bound with Ashmole's papers on Dee
(and I always wondered why he indicated this particular page, which is
a verso page so presumably does not have foliation) and the 
_Ephemerides_ containing the diary edited by Halliwell.

I am sure Clay Holden (if he listens) could give more authoritative
judgement of Dee's 8's from his extensive study of Dee's MSS.

I could not find any reproduction of Kelley's handwritten numbers -
except one very poor sample with a 7 which looks much more like
VMS foliation 7's. If VMS is a "practical joke", then of all people
Kelley would be the one capable of producing it (assuming that 
all of his visions were fake - which is a matter of belief; but even
if we assume he really contacted angelic beings, they may have
communicated another language to him - there were two Enochian 
languages before, so why not the third?). 

Best regards,

Rafal