VMs: Re: VMS numbering systems hypotheses...

[steve ekwall <ekwall2@xxxxxxxx>]

Hi ALL :-)

If by 'Currier Hand A & Currier Hand B' you mean 'Scribe A &/or Scribe
B', _OR_ two diffrent hands - "2+ people+/.....  then *YES* :-)>

I find it most amusing (in a tickleish (human/not ES) sort of way),
That THEY or s/he slowly Drops the lower (hike-shift of the gallows
c_c_'d) towards the end of the copy-flow I have here.. Almost like one
or the other said "THIS is SILLY!", OR, This is "MORE THAN SECURE"
with the preceding 1/2 coded as it is... "WE are at the BACK or ENDing
Already... IF one doesn't *SEE* the front they will be LOST before the
MIDDLE" sort of thing!... ("WE've NO need to FLIP so much etc.. just
write IT down in either "MIRRORED" CODE! / NOT _Double'C_C'd_ Mirrored
Code every (random) so often as a scribe(s) feels like it!!! etc...))


"IT's Simple, NOT THAT HARD!" -=se=-

"just, GO WITH THE FLOW!!" -=se=-


This 1/2'ing (Folding) CODE works ALSO with just HALF of IT! - no need
to FLIP (e.g. (vms) C_(eva T)_C) IT etc.. but IT is really _confusing
IF you "DON'T FLIP"_ when "THEY" (Pointers (each character) on the VMS
page) SAY "FLIP!", as you "compound" your troubles/decoding there
etc.. Hence one gets a LOW entropy for any language that is ~Thrown @
IT~ (computer wise), and of course the 'pointer(s) characters' would
not fit into a Linguists field of play.. 

If you don't FOLD the KEY, (sigh) :-(,

THEN, You'd simply have to go BACK to a beginning of "A" vms page (any
page will do) or a "START" ?(master.key)? character there....  to
continue etc.. (there may be some attach/continued ~folio'd~ pages,
but since I can't READ IT, I don't know.. ~RAts~ (SORRY!)... much is
still a mystery for _everyone to help out on!_

Hence (ES was Right - cool?:-)) you DON'T NEED THE MASTER KEY! PAGE(s)

This is !HARD in ASCII TYPE! (please open your minds etc..)

but I will try again, :-)

e.g.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
BELOW: (ascii) "o"=NULL,  `in english - sorry :-( '

Try to *SEE* this entire LAYOUT as a Tic.Tac.Toe type Board "#",
BUT EACH is a TTT (3x3) "AREA KEY: IN ITS OWN RIGHT!!!"

Simple MASTER KEY (to be FOLDED) (in ENGLISH only)
(POINT TO YOUR AREA using 3x3 key) SHIFT using "Gallows" or FOLDING
SHAPE(s)* as to the NEXT SECTION - ADD "C_C's" etc.. to backup from
where you have your finger during "CODING" to GET THERE (next
character) etc..




JKLo123oABC
MNOo456oDEF
PQRo789oGHI
STUoooooSTU
VWXoooooVWX
YZ0oooooYZ0
ABCo123oJKL
DEFo456oMNO
GHIo789oPQR


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


"The Center is mine! and YOURS" (per ES) so I choose the vms figure
pointer "8" IT SEEM TO CROSS THE CENTER AND POINT TO THE CENTER ALL IN
ONE STROKE of the QWILL ? as X the CENTER - eh ?? 

for the (above ooo
               ooo
               ooo>



hence the "internal" or we are already there coder(s)/coding  
pointers...

4e2
s8\
goa 

(major vms Strokes/characters) minus c's + \\'S


now, MOST IMPORTANT!! - Forget the TTT (tic.Tac.Toe) board stuff and
THINK and GO with the FLOW or FOLD of EACH Character you are looking
at to DECODE THIS!!


The FOLD was (per ES) the same as the english example above, but I
don't KNOW WHERE to put the letters???  - (nor which Language
it's in?) -- help???

* ES said (see FOLD'ing <a
href="http"//www.diac.com/~ekwall2/voynich/"> here </a>, that the
ORDER of the FOLD is:



413
5x8
726



so by simply(?) giving each square (9x9 = 81 total) a place holder(#)
we could Shift-them / Flip Them on the Fly as it were... I can do this
manually, but it is a 1 point and a 1 decode thing here for me (sigh)
plus I'm sure it is NOT in English! so I need help...Both COMPUTER
guys/gals and LINGUIST guys/gals

BTW:

Any and ALL NUMBERS 123445679+8956752341 etc.. + ALL Letters can be
'pointed' to using a FOLDed key. (personally I don't think the numbers
go THAT HIGH in the VMS (ha.haa) but they would all be ~scripted~ in
the Foldings and "NOT Appear" to the human eye as such (as it where).


Have a good weekend there! :-)

Best to you and yours
-=se=-
steve (& you think "you're confused?") ekwall

PS when in doubt " CHARGE! " -=se=- :-))




-=se=-)

Who the scribe(s) was/were? (I don't know)
 WHAT LANGUAGE? (I don't know) :-/

But the ENDING pages of the VMS should be 1/2 as easy to decode as the
Beginning! :-)) post fold-outs 110+ :-)


<-=se=-


 

 Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2002 15:57:36 +0000
 From: Philip Neal <philipneal_vms@xxxxxxxxxxx>
 To: Voynich Ms. mailing list <voynich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
 Cc: voynich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 Subject: VMs:  Re: VMS numbering systems hypotheses...
 
 
 
 
 >Here's a question for you: do Currier Hand A and Currier Hand B both have
 >pages where they write alternate lines, or is it a practice only carried
 >out by one of them?
 >
 >Also: do you know of any evidence in other (roughly contemporaneous) copied
 >manuscripts of lines having been copied out of order?
 >
 
 My suggestion about alternate lines referred to certain pages of
 Currier B only.
 
 I put this forward as speculation: I am by no means certain of it,
 and now that I have the entire copyflo I am looking at other
 explanations for the flow of the lines. It is very common for
 interlinear glosses to be written in the order I have suggested -
 i.e. you would write a page of Latin and then insert a vernacular
 translation in between the lines.
 
 Philip Neal
 
 
 
 
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