RE: VMs: Time to get hands dirty

["Don Latham" <djl@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

exeunt, pursued by a bear

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:owner-vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx]On
Behalf Of steve ekwall
Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 2:19 AM
To: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: VMs: Time to get hands dirty



Jacques Guy <jguy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes:

 There aren't many weapons in the arsenal. If the VMs is a cipher, then
 it is a cipher which _lowers_ the entropy of the text. The only cipher
 that can do that (Jim Gillogly, please correct me) is a cipher that
 encodes single characters of the plain texts as sequences of characters,
 or whole words and sentences. E.g. cat -> cloakarmtower (c > cloak, etc.)
 Even so, the cipher has to be a bijection: c becomes cloak only and not
other
 words. There is another possibility: lots of nulls. It is much like
 cat -> cloakarmtower, except that you are allowed any number of words
 to encipher each letter _provided that_ they are built on strict, narrow
 patterns. I'll take French "javanais" to illustrate this. The rule is:
 insert "av" before the first vowel of every syllable. Thus: "bonjour"
 -> "bavonjavour". Modify the rule to: insert "av", or "ov", or "ugl"
 and you get a cipher text with a lower entropy than the plain text.
 In that case, the VMs is very short, and the labels must be ignored.
 Possible, of course. But in that case, without need for further
examination,
 both Levitov's and Stojko's decipherment can be dismissed because they
 do not posit such a cipher.

-=se=->
(AND, they said you wouldn't be driven MAD by this!) author unknown

(GuLp!)

...<WEIRD RANT = ON>

ARRGGGGGGG!! JUST "FOLD KEY & FLIP IT!" (ref: gallows chars)
_ALL GALLOWS START_ EACH and Every PAGE SEEEEEEEeeeeeee!!!!!!
Exception is? few"o"_gallows = MEANS CONTINUATION FROM LAST PAGE
(ie f35 f56 etc) thus SEE 1st gallows on f34 f55 etc..for KEY.
BUT, "MAJORITY" are started with the Folded GALLOWS char!
ARRGgGGggg ..okokok ok Calm down steve ~shhHHhh (geeze)....

<WEIRD RANT = OFF>....

hLAYER / PER GALLOWs !!  Thus EVERY gallows ~CHANGES~ THE STEP COUNT!~
It's "circular."

[..!!!..]
One M U S T ALWAYS start at the _Beginning_ 'gallow figure'! (there
are just (ONLY) 8 of THEM!) - Twice/Thrice as hard as "normal" but
doable, simple all the same... just never lose track of where your AT
for a char, or where you just CAME FROM - to point TO where you are
going for "IT's" NEXT character!!!


All the confussion of BOTH sides (Literary and Crypto's) drives me to
almost tears at times :-( , I feel like NOAH trying to tell everyone
here to just build a BOAT - BeFoRe the FLOOD!- lol & (SIGH) :-((..

alas - no one ~listens~/or/Hears... ok ok ok  :-/// 8am8am8am

Anyway, I will say once again - It IS MOST IMPORTANT to FOLD the
GALLOWS (KEY) - THAT is known the as the START KEY on EACH page!!!
(ex: END/INDEX of vms)  That is why ES said
you Don't NEED OLD the KEY(s) to read it! - & just SEE the MIRROR !!


FWIW:

I think (todate - in reminiscence of ES)

1) THE KEY is coded (in same) alphabet x2 (inverted alphabet - hence
   MIRROR?) (image/or reversed?) but NOT BOTH: IT is simple AFTER key

2) THE "lower" char's are "Pointers" too!!
   [& ALL chars are 'Stand-Alone'] - bye-bye-eva?
Artful 'embelishments' license.

lower case (1/2 anyway) are:

    4,e,\?
    2,8,\
    g,o,a (long tail on eva a)

(I've gotten to 81 (9x9) for MASTER key pg etc.) (-6))
ALL Alphanumeric chars and ALL (*WoW)NUMBERS(*WoW*) ARE \\\hidden!

P.S. It is NOT in ENGLISH :-/

_Simple_ Coding pattern (folding per GALLOWS) is repetitive!..
Well, THAT's NICE anyway?  (lol) Get the whole ms in one code break!

Someone last week emailed: THIS CANNOT be an ORAL Tradition CODE ! I
beg to DIFFER as it would be FAR EASIER to draw this in the SAND face
to face then to try to re-re-explain IT here in ascii chars..


3) The Tic-Tac-Toe Board (unfolded Fold KEY(s)) squares - yields 8 [IF
   "The CENTER IS YOURS".] (not used? as in PEGGED on the HARD copy
   KEY (by/to) ROTATING the key!> else 9: ES's / 3 3 !9! ?

4) Lose the " rotation " (lose the FLIP IT on 'gallow characters) and
   your HOLE is twice as deep to DEcode it ! PERIOD!!! IT get's worse
   with _every_ gallows too !!!! Multiplying effect (can you say
   TIMES 'factorial'?) - ES? s/he? was a sly one:
   THEY (gallows) ARE Beginning & MID-Word for a very good
   reason!! One Doesn't need a gallows character on the END except for
   NULL char or post-page etc..

Even on just "To" or _3_ "L_t_R" words!
     4.1> And at END (word) to change KEY (decode) PAGE!
     4.2> Simple Drop a letter or ADD a letter per 'gallows char'.

5> This FOLDING/FlipPing is for VMS "TEXT" decoding ONLY
   5.1> I know NOT (via ES) what the 'Pictures' are of.
   5.2> I know NOT (via ES) what 'language' IT is in :-(
   5.3> I (apparently) per ES I will never "READ IT"??? ~bummer!~

6> IF you study EACH CHARacter - you will see ThAt thEy are more and
   MORE a "stand ALONE CHARACTER!" vioala! while ~scripted~ looking
   they are ALL 'pointers' a "simple code" yet NOt SO SIMPLE, If you
   do not follow the "rotation", There *IS* a method for EACH Word /
   even each letter /&/it will
   have/has it's/the ability
to
   ChAnGE!!!!!!!!

7>
   ACTUALLY the KEY(s) never had to be here.. maybe the ~missing pages
   are really good/ripe/juicey stuff? chars. - (ha.ha) who knows??

8> ES was NOT a ~Dream~ - Was NOT a ~Drug Over-dose~ (unless the wife
   nailed me here THAT NIGHT (ha.ha)) (huMMMm??) can you say Rasputan
   AND never returned (~Rats~ - now I have 1,000 MORE questions).
   Things can work in mysterious ways - they say! (& WhO aRe THEY?)

   8:1> Out of the Blue Sky - I have this 'unknown' ANSWER to a
         Quest I never even heard of THEN: VMS Stuffed
          in my lap?   go RE-figure???   H*ll,I know all NOT !!!

Take care there,

Sorry to bother you with THIS "other arsenal answer" again;
NOT telling you to build an ARK
Don't look for 40 day FLOODS/Rains etc..
NO prophet here by a _l o n g_ shot,
just touched _once_ `rats' :-(
~WeIrEd~ old topic too (he.hee)

BUT - (by golly) "IF it's "Voynich" then FOLD & FLIP IT" !!!!

Hope this finds you & yours well
-=se=-
steve (yea yea) ekwall

http://www.diac.com/~ekwall2/voynich

PS. BEFORE you _finally_ leave the FOLDING on a BACK MENTAL burner
there, remember a '3 wheel combo-pack' (locksmith jargon) has just 100
possibilites PER WHEEL. Right/Left/Right? Left/Right/Left? So, 3 x 100
x 3 = 900? NOOOoo, !!! IT's _Factorial_ into "MILLIONS of VMS
Combinations" etc..


VMS is (just) "8" deep" KEYed! Rotated on it's own gallow characters.

<-=se=-



REF:
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:30:15 +0100
From: "Anders, Claus" <Claus.Anders@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
To: "'vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx'" <vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: VMs: AW: Trying to create a test for letter 'value'

Here are my resluts of a quick test on 6988 tokens:
j 1
x 6
i 6
q 444
m 114
f 66
p 188
e 67
t 214
h 5
n 31
d 429
s 383
o 737
k 180
r 305
a 173
l 532
y 842

i.e "j" changed only once a token and y 842 times.How would you interpret
these figures?

Claus

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Robert Antony Hicks [mailto:rob_hicks_vms@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Gesendet: Freitag, 21. Februar 2003 12:07
An: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
Betreff: VMs: Trying to create a test for letter 'value'


I wish to create a test for the 'value' of letters within the VMS.  I have
the basic programming skills to make a utility, but I need a bit of help
establishing what algorithm to use.  I'd better explain what I mean by
value-

I define the value, V, of a particular letter as a measure of how frequently

the letter is the difference between two otherwise identical words.

For example,

Consider a text containing just four words :  okol okoy okcy kcy

There are 5 different letters in the text : o, k, l, y and c.

Letter o has V=2/4=0.5 because it distinguishes between okol and okcy and
okcy and kcy out of the three words.

Letter k has V=0 because it does not distinguish between any of the words.

Letter l has V=1/4=0.25 because it distinguishes between okol and okoy out
of the three words.

Letter y has V=1/4=0.25 because it distinguishes between okol and okoy out
of the three words.

Letter c has V=1/4=0.25 because it distinguishes between okoy and okcy out
of the three words.

Thus, a value 'ranking' for the five letters is -

o     V=0.5
lyc   V=0.25
k     V=0

I hope this makes some semblance of sense.  I need help with creating an
algorithm for this - can anybody assist with pseudo-code?

Even better - does such a test already exist, and if so, what is it called
and where can I find it?

Rob


>From lroux@xxxxxxx Tue Feb 25 01:49:07 2003
Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 21:17:05 -0500
From: Larry Roux <lroux@xxxxxxx>
Reply-To: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
To: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: VMs: Time to get hands dirty

"If the VMs is a cipher, then it is a cipher which _lowers_ the entropy of
the text."

Here's another idea.  What if ALL the characters are numbers (Robert Teagues
+ some negative numbers) - just as an example:

...-3 -2 -1  0  1  2  3...
... k  t  p  f  o  r  y...

And there is a circular key written in a circular fashion.  The Voy glyphs
are then references to the next character (move 1 forward, 6 back, 8 forward
etc)

What would the entropy look like then?

Of course, the counter-argument to this is the repeated words (8ar, ol,
etc).  But I have not tried this out either.  Just a thought.

******************************
Larry Roux
Syracuse University
lroux@xxxxxxx
*******************************


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