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Re: VMs: Ryland 228 & rotatateS/8
3 deep breathes all :-)
hi all :-)
From: Nick Pelling <incoming@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<snip)......
FWIW, I suspect that Steve Ekwall may have a rough pointer to what's going
on here, in that he believes each page (or perhaps folio, or perhaps
bifolio) contains a unique key (Steve says that it's 8-characters-long,
....(end snip)
--------------------
D*rn Noah's ~FloOD~~~~ again.... (sorry - thought I did MY JOB HERE
etc..) :-))) ~~``````''''.... * - lol :-)
- I DON'T speak laywer'ese either ~RATS~ ha.haa ... anyway ALL please
read BELOW.. IF any of IT makes sense, "IF you SEE ANYTHING" in VMS
context - please feel FREE to use ANY and ALL with MY FULL
PERMISSIONS! As anyone CAN and will FOLD the KEY! - I hope EVERYONE
does FOLD and FLIP the vms key.. (enjoy)
[ pss - for those that say "flipping & folding (again) 'OH NO'",
- I think of "Lions & Tigers & Bears (wizard of oz) OH NO" (HE.HEE)
Trust me on this you all out there.
VMS _IS NOT_ in Kansas anymore Dorthy!!!]
BUT:
(IT's Simpler than you think :-)
PUT ALL YOUR LEARNED KNOWLEDGE TOGETHER NOW (& give it a "*stir*" etc)
anyway ..... ('Thinking Caps On' ok?)..-..-.
CAPS as in "headwear" - not vms.letter type (oh dear)
*YES* each gallows character STARTS the page &/or paragraph! - IT is
also embedded with (within the vms) WORDS also...These are
gallows are *switch areas*.
Ohhhhhh, if only to articulate properly (seriously, as THIS is
important!) I'm trying - I'm Trying !!!! (sigh me:-(
===================
Hi Nick & all :-)
my 2nd aside note(s):
~Folding & FlipPInG (ROTATing code)~ THE vms KEY is _NOT_ Conjectural
but more Genial done... it is ~warm~, it is nice, it is friendly :-)
so I was told anyway ... do you ALL really think I would hang around
this (albeit educational list) with my mere little ~pitter.patter~
knowing ALL the PH'Ds that are haunting around here?? Ready and
chomping at the bits to "Knock my dick in the DIRT" as they say is
western USA? (if i didn't have _something_ to say to ALL?)
*hello world?* (knock*knock?)
"Stupid me" - or, is it "Ignorant I?"
& Is (is this OR) THE ABOVE _even_ a complete sentence?> ?
So, Back to VMS :-)
note:
It's NOT "8 characte4s-LONG", but more like "8 placement AREAS" on
your KEY there. Sorry if I ever (over) misslead. :-(
8 is the MAX one can get out of 1 FOLDED VMS tic.tac.toe type KEY.
(before/without rotating it 180 degrees) well that's NOT true either -
you must _wait_ for the NEXT Gallows Character!! etc.. to APPEAR in
the
Text.) ..& you CAN have upto "7 ~MORE~ KEY(s)" different gaLLowS (8
KEY
PAGES) pages using this type code system!
(ok 9 if you ~Count CENTER~ - BUT the center is YOURS ("mine") etc..)
per ES..
9x9="81" total fold pointer characters. still surmountable.
so I will _just talk "8"_ (eight), but a TTT key does=9 squares have.
note: you don't (well duhh!!!) have to rotate OR ADD a gallows if the
NEXT CHARACTER is on your _present KEY page "already"_, thus the "8am
8am" fits perfectly _within_ (and can 2 different words) etc..
"8" is in the center. (bummer)
A simple Folded TTT "paper KEY" (but you can DRAW this in the SAND
with a stick in your hand) - makes unfolded 3x3 or 9 square(s) & THE
CENTER SQUARE is _up for grabs_ for us all. (?) Think 8 square AREAS.
The "8 _GALLOWS characters" (as they appear in the vms) "point" to the
(PRIMARYkey) position, AND the lower case - stand:alone "vms
letters/characters" "point" to it's (SECONDARYkey) position on THAT
(its)(predisclosed) PRIMARYkey keyPAGE! (presumed 1 of 8 here by
ES/se)
example
ie: 1st 1/2 _lower case_ pointer characters are:
4e2
s8\
goa
note: THESE _lower_ characters (look like ____"Scripted/Script"
)long-hand?( characaters)____ BUT EACH and EVERYONE in Voynich is a
STANDs.a.LONE character!. (Look/see/use a magnify'ing glass if need
be), in "ITS" positioning (or else it is 1 TTT keyAREA "positioning")
so,
4e2
s8\
goa
these characters "point" to "IT's" (their) positioning on the 3x3
(TTT) KEYpage you are alread ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"8 is in the CENTER for a reason!"
(VMS) Coding IT:
IF you need a new character (you find (look on IT's)
(where.it's.at)KEYpage)), Then, ADD a new gallows that "points" to
that (decode) KEY PAGE AREA!
use _lower case_ "characters" to LOCATE position(ings) of the
character to ENcode or 'DE-code' (present keypage).
*IF the character you seek is NOT on the KEY you have*, then,
just ADD the NEW _gallows shape_ that points to BOTH its Key page
"_AND_" (***most important the "AND" here****), position(ing) of the
next letter to Decode. (encode/decode=> SIMPLE:-)
That is WHY the original scribe(s) needed "8" capital "pointer"
SyMboLs?
or GALLOWS characters (shapes)! 4 UP 4 DOWN (reversed) etc..
we get 8x8 total characters (with any alpha/numeric system = 64):
(key(s) with center is 9x9 = 81):
etc... you can MIRROR (ROTATE/flip) that, (1/2'd for the entropy 32/2)
and CHANGE when you need a FRESH KEY (new page etc..)(or even think
you do) (*infinite*) and you can maybe see why the 2nd scribe in the
later halves of the VMS said just "*F* this" ... one (convolted) key
is _enough_ already, no more "flipping"!!!!. (note: lack of gallows
near ENDing of copy-flo), the lack of (flipped) c_gallows_c
note: I don't think "2nd Scribe" like hearing THIS any more than you
do now!
This "technique" will allow for gallows to ~pop~ up randomly in script
Front, middle & End of a "word" etc..
as well as "convoluding" each rotation of each & every following
gallows inserted.. which is why "logic alone" cannot decode it! -=se=-
SEE the Flowing pen.strokes strokes of the different gallowS
characters. see the AREA(s) pointed to, they direct you towards on the
KEY. *YES*, It's really just a simple 3x3 Tic.Tac.Toe board TYPE of
MASTER KEY"
(VMS) Decoding it:
FOLDING/FLIPPING always requires a "START GALLOWs" or "character
pointer figure" (per page/ chapter or folio at least) I hope the
missing pages don't turn up with any ccccccccc_cc as 1st character..
(sigh)..lol :-) big whoops for ES then!
(but there're only "8" and that is _not_ "unbustable" - & that is
GOOD for us! ?)
I really feel "stupid steve" for not being able to explain this in
ascii type here (sorry) - it's sooo Simple "KISS KISS" let me try
another example - but, the following is a ROUND (circular) KEY, NOT
(Tic.Tac.Toe) TTT (folded) example. VMSKEY = is SQUARED area (folded
paper) KEY etc. "Vms is _simple "SQUAREd" FOLDED then with Rotated
encodings".
(in your minds eye) H*ck, look at your wrist watch if you have one
on now ---- "SEE a clock !" ;-)
the (normal) Clock has 12-3-6-9 "areas" (others maybe 1-12)
*see* your clock/watch @ 12:15
(remember - if you SEE this, 'see _SQUARE' TTT KEY_ to decode vms)
THE HOUR HAND is a "Gallows character" in VMS, the minute hand
(characters) are the lower case "pointer(S)" - as to WHAT TIME
(character pointed to) IS IT (exactly)?
12:15 -yeppers- got it? -good -
continue!
Okay now STAND on your head and look at it! (oops - better yet just
TURN the CLOCK UPSIDE DOWN (THAT is EASIER (my fault - silly joke if
you had a watch on there & not a WALL CLOCK)- sorry (ha.haa)) :-(
What TIME is it now???????
The HOUR (appears) to be 6 and the minute(s) is at the 9 area (mirror)
area so, you THINK? it now SAYS "6:45" - hummmmm - it's OK OK OK!!!!!
(no AM/PM in ES/VMS or day light savings time etc..) (phewww - thank
God, unless it's our 2nd scribe making funnies?>
THESE can appear as mirror "pairs" - BUT depending on the PREVIOUS
hour hand setting.. we don't/won't know the 12 o'clock setting (or
even Starting KEY gallows AREA - This IS NEEDED TO START per PAGE!).
OK get off your your upside down head if you followed this so far, and
now THINK ABOUT a CLOCK that only has 8 hours! (only 8 hours? *yes*
only 8 hours)
did I mention only 8? ok Sorry, but do reTHINK in 8 areas!!!
think square 8 hour clock.... =||=
<(so how the gallows chars work - gallows=> HOUR hand on above clock)>
see 8 hour clock etc..
YES - only EIGHT (8) ~count 'em 8 hours!~ - but get ready to return to
a SQUARE CLOCK.. the "minute hand" POINTS to the AREA (as in minutes -
duh!) but actually points to the simple letter that we want to
decode.. the 1st HOUR hand TELLS you what (keyPAGE) your ON! So what
is the VMS character pointing to etc..???
as:
7 (hour hand) see key page 7
3 (hour hand) see key page 3
11 (hour hand) see key page 11
>>>>>>> oops there IS NO 11 in an 8 o'clock clock DUH !!- sorry
REMEMBER that with the "8 VMS Gallows characters" too - thx<<<<<<<
*JUsT seEing if You'RE PayinG atTentioN herE (ha.haa) - sorRy (ahummm)
thus in (redo 8 HR clock etc..):
7 (hour hand) see KEY page 7!
3 (hour hand) see KEY page 3!
8 (hour hand) see KEY page 8!
The HOUR hand is a "Gallows Character" the others place themselves as
minute pointers.. the characters are NOT chosen by random - But are
chosen by which position and KEY (/page/hour) they are on the CODED
ORIGINAL
((follow this technique PER PAGE) (where your finger is in front of
you)) KEY... (see 1st Gallows character at top of each page your
starting DEcoding figure etc..)
NOW, (hike / shift (Flip/Rotate) etc..)
You/WE only get a SQUARE CLOCK (~bummer~) sorry - hey, I didn't think
of the vms - I promise (I wasn't even BORN yet then etc...) and it's
FOLDED PAPER KEY that you can draw in the SAND - once you get it- I
don't even think they had (round tic.tock) clocks back then either!
(so if the above example is bad, excuse me, IF _ANYONE_ here "clicks"
with IT then, then it was a 1/2 way good analogy?
anyway:
your "square clock" has just 8 hours
like this:
123
4*5
678
(note 1-9 "9"(areas) * is CENTER (leaving 8 TTT areas)
EACH gallows POINTs to the (hour-clock) MASTER KEY page(s).
(we only have 8)...
MORE vms mysteriouslyness's_ is THEY ARE OUT OF (left to right) ORDER
!!! (I just made that word up - but it FITs :-)) -=se=-
THEY (lower characters) FOLLOW the same ~pattern(s)~ of the FOLDING
TECHNIQUE OF THE _BASIC FOLDED VMS MASTERKEY_
see folded/UNfolded (before flip) as
312
4*8
756
The gallows FOLLOW this ordering, AND the lower characters shape
pointers FOLLOW this ordering & are BOTH a constant place holder
(ponter as it were)... you can derive this ~pattern~ or ordering
yourself by just folding a piece of paper and mark its area(s) as you
/UNFOLD IT 3 3 9, (see http:www.diac.com/~ekwall2/voynich) for rough
folding example.
ps Voynich code is neither an ONION SKIN Layer'd code - nor even a
ROSE Totto.. more like a chinese wooden puzzle box with (1) THIS piece
slides, then (2) THAT piece can NOW slide!, then (3) back to 1 (slide
1 MORE again), then (4) back to
THAT slides _even more_ - & viola! -it's OPEN- type of coding...
The basic fold(ing) should hold through out ALL the VMS
pages. (per ES)
That is why we won't need any ~missing?~ MASTERKEY pages?
Hope this helps someone out there
Best to you & yours :-)
-=se=-
steve () ekwall
yea yea "touched in the head steve - i know/know i"
[last thoughts tonight]
But, It's actually SIMPLER THAN YOU THINK!
K*I*S*S K*I*S*S
ps. someone last month or so - ASKed me to ~knock-off~ the
CaPiToliZatioNs in my e.mails here... I was rude in reply and would
like to REapplogize - BUT, that is "JUSt thE CAsE HeRE in VmS!! 8am
8am (FLIP your Keys - ladies & gentlemans) ((-: :-))
"iT iS WriTTeN (COdeD) lIKe THiS..... <- see "GaLLows".....
U{pper) l(OWER> case "POINTERS" etc...
pss also if someone joins "this list" and says "Like Hey Dudes I'm 4
of 12!", "What's up?-"" - please just lend him/her a pa\i\tent ear!
?? An "Indian" will come (ES)
pss Nick has the "openist mind here?", GC has the LOGIC to contain it
ALL...(but is looking _into IT_ TOO deeply), others are way over my
head.. (so be gentle and don't kill the messenger yet).. I finally see
why the TIME is NOW, BUT there is no HURRY.. So, to nick, gc & all -
stupid steve ponders - why i feel I could sit outside with a stick in
my hand and "Draw in the SAND the ANSWER!" more easily then trying to
convey the simple shape construction of the gallows and the pointer
charachters to all ?????
GO with the gallows character(s), Go with their FLOW !!!
I REREAD THIS Three + times and would not even send the above to my
own Mother, so I hope whomever "gets this" _KNOWS_ what I'm talking
about. It sounds ~Crazy~ - but its per ES!
May it help all;
-=se=-
steve (best to you & yours) ekwall
OK Ok ok o.. ~back under my rock here~ :-)
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