VMs: forwarded: Re: Tataric in Voynich Manuscript? (fwd)

[Mart Vabar <mesinik@xxxxxx>]

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sun, 11 Apr 2004 17:04:05 +0400
From: Irek Bikkinin <irek@*****.ru>
To: Mart Vabar <mesinik@xxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Tataric in Voynich Manuscript?

Dear Mart,

1. Mysterious symbols could be special letters for special sounds.
2. Almost all the cited words have clear sense in Turkic (and even Tatar)
dialects.
But I wouldn't dare to give translations of whole sentences.
3. "Ts"  instead of "Ch" is common for Mishar dialect of the Tatar language.
Also "Ts" is used in a dialect of Balkar language, and in Siberian dialect
of Tatar language. "Ts"  instead of "Ch" is used by part of Mordvas and
Russians which contacted much with the Mishars. Though approximately half of
Mishars use common Turkic "Ch". I am Mishar and I pronounce "Ch" and
sometimes even "S" instead of common "Ch" (like Bashkirs).


Regards,
Irek.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mart Vabar" <mesinik@***.ee>
To: "Irek Bikkinin" <irek@*****.ru>
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2004 4:34 PM
Subject: Re: Tataric in Voynich Manuscript?


>
> On Sat, 10 Apr 2004, Irek Bikkinin wrote:
> > Dear Mart,
> > Can you send me some pieces of text in modern English letters?
> > It's quite difficult for me to recognize most of the letter of the VMS
text.
>
> I absolutely agree.
> You see, nobody can't be sure about many of these these letters.
> It's clear, most of these originate from a XVth century Renessaince
> hand-written letters, but some remain mysterious...
>
> ... also, if you scroll down my e-mail, you find, what I could do
> in this field. But don't expect, it could be cleartext modern Tataric.
>
> This stuff could be a hoax, a ciphertext or just a joke.
> If it's cleartext, then it could be some strange mix of
> languages or some lost dialect... etc... you have to keep
> in mind, this is called "the most mysterious manuscript in the world"
> and this is not a joke!
>
>
> so, I scroll down, where is my attempt to transcribe some parts
> of it on-the-fly:
> > >  PPPPPS
> > >  Since this old XV-th century font in VMS needs some time to
> > > get familiar with letter-shapes, I will send some transcriptions
> > > (beware, attention, ostorozhno, these are disputable in everything,
> > > don't look at them without the corresponding pages of VMS itself!)!
> > > Let's take
> > > http://130.132.81.124/PHOTONEGIMG/zoom/Z361/z3610557.jpg
> > > in the center of this "page 67" with "sun-moon-stars-group", some
labels
> > in
> > > sectors could maybe, MAYBE read like this:
> > >
> > >  okeey sar
> > >  okiol sal
> > >  ykeeody  (ykuody?)
> > >  otaldy
> > >  otaky
> > >  sosain(?sosam? ?sosaiiv?)
> > >  otuy dan (? oteey dan?)
> > >
> > >  PPPPPPS
> > >  let's take
> > > http://130.132.81.124/PHOTONEGIMG/zoom/Z361/z3610562.jpg
> > > http://130.132.81.124/PHOTONEGIMG/zoom/Z361/z3610561.jpg
> > > some labels there could read so:
> > >  "opharalar"
> > >  "otany"
> > >  "okolar"
> > >  "otalody"
> > >  "ot?eody"
> > > In the center is written "May", in relatively clear and ordinary
Latin, in
> > > different manner and maybe later
> > >
> > >  the second text-ring (of three) at "z3610562.jpg", beginning at left
> > > (I emphasize once more, many of letters in this transcription are
probably
> > > wrong, especially the sounds s-, ts-,sh- )
> > > "oteodar ytey otey shetey tseotshor okalal otam sholam otam shetey
tseolon
> > oteo
> > > teeody otar tsokam (?tsokain?) okam alalo tseedy oteorar tseky tsokal
otar
> > > ??o?okal"
> > >
> > >  I try also at outmost text-ring in "z3610561.jpg", the upper half:
> > > "osheo pharar oteeodam she ateey dam oteokeey dal al oteey teeydy
oteey
> > keey"
> > > and the next "word" is out of picture. BTW, these double-e' letters
are
> > > suspiciuos too (could they be c-letters in some special form?) ...
don't
> > be too
> > > confident about the transcription...
> > >
> kontaktinfo ja telefonid:
> http://www.ehi.ee/~mesinik
>

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