Re: VMs: A Possible Interpretation of the Four Figures, one with an Egg

["Jeff" <jeff@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi Pamela

Very interesting that you should mention Marsilio Ficino! *GRIN*

Jeff

----- Original Message -----
From: "Pamela Richards" <spirlhelix@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 11 September 2004 01:12
Subject: Re: VMs: A Possible Interpretation of the Four Figures, one with an
Egg


> Hi, Nick
>
> I, for one, haven't really drawn any conclusions about
> the figures in the flower-petal (tombstone) sections
> yet; at least, I have not placed the symbols displayed
> with any specific mythology yet, although I have a few
> ideas.  I think the VMs author was clever enough to
> obscure some of his symbology through the use of
> varying myths, as a little "symbology encryption"
> bonus.  But thanks for sharing your speculations!
>
> Eric spoke of doing some work to "clean up" these
> images.  Do I understand you to mean that these
> figures are not discernable in the actual document
> because of the flower-petal pattern?  Does the image
> need to be altered in order to see the figures in the
> first place?  That would be very interesting.
>
> Did Kieckhefer happen to observe that the spirits
> being called up were thought to have been connected
> with the fixed stars? Angelic spirits,  "evil"
> spirits; even the spirits of the dead were so
> associated, presumably each with its own star.
>
> All very "Eighth Sphere" stuff.  And yet the birth of
> children was thought to be accompanied by the same
> gifts of "star spirits" or "guardian angels".
>
> See works of Cornelius Agrippa and Marsilio Ficino for
> more details.
>
> Shakespeare understood this belief and used it in at
> least one of his plays; see the opening chapter of
> Hamlet and the remarks about the effects of the
> unusual star or comet observed from the battlements.
>
> If there is anything in the VMs that describes
> necromancy, that would be a good reason for the tight
> encryption.  Necromancy was punishable by death.
> However, I would think twice about the idea that a
> document bearing on such content was knowingly sold to
> royalty.  Either the VMs is a different document, or
> Rudoplh II had no idea of the details of its contents,
> or the author had lost control of it before it reached
> the hands of Rudolph.  Or all three.  But I am very
> hestitant to imagine that someone knowingly placed a
> recipe for necromancy in the hands of the Holy Roman
> Emperor, no matter how interested he may have been in
> esoteric subjects.
>
> Thanks for the stimulating discussion!
>
> Warmly,
>
> Pam
>
> --- Nick Pelling <nickpelling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > At 12:57 08/09/2004 -0700, Eric wrote:
> > >For similar drawings in the VMS, please look at the
> > >images on folio 85r2 and 86v4. One set of four,
> > >probably male, figures around the sun. One set of
> > >four, probably female, figures around the moon.
> > Lots
> > >of objects being held - eggs, cups, bowls, wheat or
> > >straw, flower, chain, cane, etc. (all up for
> > debate).
> > >One female figure points away from the viewer. Raw
> > >images and some clean up I have done are at:
> > >
> > >http://www.rebelconcept.com/voynich/male_female.htm
> > >
> > >While these don't have the rings of letters around
> > >them like f57v, they are surrounded by copy and
> > have
> > >possibly richer content in their illustration. In
> > any
> > >case, they are the most similar diagrams to the
> > >figures on f57v.
> >
> > While I'm happy with the cosmological / astrological
> > / zodiacal / strega /
> > agricultural / calendrical interpretation of Quires
> > 9-11, the
> > above-mentioned set of three circular diagrams seem
> > to be playing a
> > different role - carrying a different kind of
> > information.
> >
> > FWIW, my current train of thought on this particular
> > set of pages was
> > prompted by Eric's take on f86r2 and f86v4: as much
> > of my work has gone
> > into trying to read the visual languages in the VMs,
> > the idea that the
> > female/moon page was deliberately obscured by the
> > rows of "tombstones" -
> > apparently some kind of steganography - is
> > particularly interesting. Take
> > away the obscuring tombstones and what remains on
> > the page? Perhaps the
> > answer is simply "a magic circle".
> >
> > ATM I'm carefully re-reading Richard Kieckhefer's
> > excellent "Forbidden
> > Rites", which describes Clm 849 (a 15th century
> > necromancer's
> > manual/compilation from Munich) in detail: there,
> > magic circles tend to
> > accompany what Kieckhefer classifies as
> > "illusionist" demonic magic - many
> > of those rites involve drawing out a circle
> > (sometimes with the blood of a
> > hoopoe, etc), and invoking various sets of demonic
> > spirits representing the
> > four main compass directions (which I've mentioned
> > before in the context of
> > f57v). Perhaps that specifically is what we're
> > looking at (through  some
> > kind of visual steganographic filter) here: it would
> > seem a fairly good
> > candidate.
> >
> > Finally, Kieckhefer briefly mentions some late
> > Byzantine demonic magic in
> > one footnote, and that might also be an interesting
> > tradition to look at in
> > this context. Just a thought! :-)
> >
> > Cheers, .....Nick Pelling.....
> >
> >
> >
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>
>
> =====
> "I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand
stars how not to dance."
>
>
>
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