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Re: Re: Re: VMs: A very important discovery!!

Hello Jan :-)

sorry to not edit or snip (below), but the gallows ARE VERY IMPORTANT!
gallows are NOT problimatic, nor random, nor inserted after a certain 
"number of 'strokes'" in the vms (per ES) They are the KEY to the 
code (per se).

 Date: Wed, 29 Sep 2004 19:17:38 -0500
 From: jan <hurychj@xxxxxxxxx>
 Reply-To: vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx
 To: "vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx" <vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx>
 Subject: Re: Re: Re: VMs: A very important discovery!!
 Hello Steve, 
 do we have  some statistics of the number of characters between two gallows (any kind of gallows)? I 
 do not mean where in particular word is they are located;  I pressume that the gallows were inserted 
 after certain  no. of characters (the numbers being variable but not random.   It would probably need 
 some  tricky program (we have 4 gallows types).

1. since the gallows are inserted (per scribes whim) randomly, there 
are 'no statistics' that will mate up with input.output
2. gallows 'point' to at least 3 if not 4 area depending where you are 
in the ms
2.1 1st gallows 'points' where to start! (which area of which key)
2.2 any gallows 'points' to its position on 4x4 (x2 mirror) key.
2.3 c_gallows_c causes complete system mirror (flipping of key/paper)
2.4 (2.3 c_gallows_c) creates 8 gallows type (not just 4) ... SEE THE 

 Personally, I do not see  any particular reason to switch between 4 ( OK, maybe only two tables or 
 grills) so often. But, the idea about beginning and end rings the bell, yes -  the one legged and two 
 legged  gallows, were carefully drawn, especially the one crossing the first leg backwards! Or could 
 they mean  the real pauses between words? No, the words would be sometimes too long, very long. 
 And we woudl not  need four types od them . . .
now I really smile, as i don't think i know what the h*ck you 
just said, OR even what you are asking me here??

(i'll try my best though)...

grills/tables? there are 4 in folded areas x2 

((x2 = mirror side of the master key) = 8))

one-legged two-legged? (smiles) these are just distingushing strokes 
indicate which of the above (#) areas _they_ 'point_er' to. 
see: http://www.diac.com/~ekwall2/voynich/folding101.shtml/
each SHAPE (1 leg/2 leg etc.)is required to SIMPLY point to the area 
of ones TTT (#) KEY..

[next ?]
pauses/spaces? between words ARE REAL (what you SEE is what you get!)

hope this/that above helps you
BEST to you & yours there
steve (crazy, but fits all (?'s)=> FoLdInG) ekwall

p.s. you won't/don't switch sides so often as you will HAVE TO SWITCH 
to find the letter/_char_ you what to convey. code/decode etc. 

p.s.s. it's all in the archieves here
(see the Mirror - The Time is NOW etc.)

 =======  You wrote:  
 >hi all :-)
 >On 29 Sep 2004 08:47:52 +0200
 > From: elvogt@xxxxxxxxxxx
 > Elmar wrote:
 > > On Tue, 28 Sep 2004, jan wrote:
 > > > There are the sections in the VM, where the SAME gallows follow each
 > > > other - in the same paragraph and with the other characters in between
 > > > but without different gallows in between. What would be the need for
 > > > that (one gallows would normally do)?
 > > 
 > Perhaps the gallows are a relative indicator, rather than an absolute one?
 > "f" -> switch to next table, "t" -> switch to previous table, etc.
 > That'd readily explain two identical gallows following each other, and it would 
 > point to an amount of five Ridderstad tables.
 >    Elmar
 > -------------------------------------------------
 >for those seeking numeric's with the vms,
 >A "fair?" respresentation of SAME gallows following each other might 
 >be 1st line of f45r. here the line ends with 3 SAME gallows. 
 >unique to this page is it also STARTS with the SAME gallows.
 >(FWIW: this 1st gallows is NOT the same 'pointer_to_char' as the last 
 >3 SAME gallows, as the 3rd gallows in this 1st line has already 
 >flipped/rotated the table/key). 
 >in the FOLDing scheme of things,
 > i would highly suspect that these 
 >last 3,4 SAME gallows are within a NUMBERS (as opposed to alphebetic) 
 >area/TABLE at this point of decoding.
 >while my previous a.b.c-1.2.3 #### posting had 'everybody in order', 
 >it may well be that
 >follows the same FOLDing scheme as its gallows counterpart to 
 >sorry i don't know for sure, BUT it is interesting the the 4 is static 
 >in both this positions AND that is the SAME as the gallow_char.
 >steve (#'s 4 in there somewhere?) ekwall
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