Re: VMs: oops+A very important discovery!!

[steve ekwall <ekwall2@xxxxxxxx>]

 From: steve ekwall <ekwall2@xxxxxxxx>
 
 Hello all :-) 

slight correction of the use of 'whim' (as in it's upto "the scribers 
whi"m).
 
[snip]

i (ekwall) previously wrote> 
 -=se=->
 1. since the gallows are inserted (*per scribes whim) randomly, there 
 are 'no statistics' that will mate up with input.output
 2. gallows 'point' to at least 3 if not 4 area depending where you are 
 in the ms
 2.1 1st gallows 'points' where to start! (which area of which key)
 2.2 any gallows 'points' to its position on 4x4 (x2 mirror) key.
 2.3 c_gallows_c causes complete system mirror (flipping of key/paper)
 2.4 (2.3 c_gallows_c) creates 8 gallows type (not just 4) ... SEE THE 
 MIRROR !
 <-=se=-

*ref: 'scribes whim'

on #1. (*above) i meant to indicate that a scribe could flip over his 
masterkey anytime he felt like it.. (as BOTH side of the key hold 
all the SAME numerals & alphabet)..these 'whims' will be when the 4 
c_gallow_c are used.. the c_*_c IS the FLIP it OVER indicator. It is 
NOT a 'whim' when a (plain)gallows is used in a coded/decoding 
scheme. 

YOU still have to point to the correct _char_ area else you get 
gibberish.
(example: (trying, trying AS YOU CAN GO @ (TWO) ways here:That is, to 
spell 
out a word (say CAT for example).. YOU must either already be in the # 
area with "C","A" in it, else you _HAVE_ to USE the appropriate gallow 
_char_ to point to it..(NO WHIM HERE) note: WHICH GALLOW YOU CHOSE 
ALSO 
PLACES INTO 
THE CORRECT # area], in the _other side of your key. ~SiMpLe~ :-)

--- you will smile at yourself when you *SEE* this (mirror or not) 
:-)--


 
  
  Personally, I do not see  any particular reason to switch between 4 ( OK, maybe only two tables or 
  grills) so often. But, the idea about beginning and end rings the bell, yes -  the one legged and two 
  legged  gallows, were carefully drawn, especially the one crossing the first leg backwards! Or could 
  they mean  the real pauses between words? No, the words would be sometimes too long, very long. 
  And we woudl not  need four types od them . . .
  
  Jan 
    
 -=se=-> 
 now 'I really smile', as i don't think i know what the h*ck you 
 just said, OR even what you are asking me here??
 
 (i'll try my best though)...
 
 grills/tables? there are 4 in folded areas x2 
 ###
 # 
 
 ((x2 = mirror sided of the master key)
###
# #
###

 = 8))
 
 one-legged two-legged? (smiles) these are just distingushing _chars_ 
 to 
 indicate which of the above (#) areas _they_ 'point_er' to. 
 see: http://www.diac.com/~ekwall2/voynich/folding101.shtml/
 each SHAPE (1 leg/2 leg etc.)is required to SIMPLY point to the area 
 of ones TTT (#) KEY..
 
 [next ?]
 pauses/spaces? between words ARE REAL (what you SEE is what you get!)
 
 hope this/that above helps you
 BEST to you & yours there
 -=se=-
 steve (crazy, but fits all (?'s)=> FoLdInG) ekwall
 
 p.s. you won't/don't switch sides so often as you will HAVE TO SWITCH 
 to find the letter/_char_ you want to convey. code/decode etc. 
 <=-se=-
 
 p.s.s. it's all in the archieves here
 (see the Mirror - The Time is 'NOW' etc.)
 
  =======  You wrote:  
  >hi all :-)
  >
  >On 29 Sep 2004 08:47:52 +0200
  > From: elvogt@xxxxxxxxxxx
  > Elmar wrote:
  > 
  > 
  > > On Tue, 28 Sep 2004, jan wrote:
  > > > There are the sections in the VM, where the SAME gallows follow each
  > > > other - in the same paragraph and with the other characters in between
  > > > but without different gallows in between. What would be the need for
  > > > that (one gallows would normally do)?
  > > 
  > 
  > Perhaps the gallows are a relative indicator, rather than an absolute one?
  > 
  > "f" -> switch to next table, "t" -> switch to previous table, etc.
  > 
  > That'd readily explain two identical gallows following each other, and it would 
  > point to an amount of five Ridderstad tables.
  > 
  >    Elmar
  > 
  > 
  > -------------------------------------------------
  >for those seeking numeric's with the vms,
  >
  >A "fair?" respresentation of SAME gallows following each other might 
  >be 1st line of f45r. here the line ends with 3 SAME gallows. 
  >
  >unique to this page is it also STARTS with the SAME gallows.
  >(FWIW: this 1st gallows is NOT the same 'pointer_to_char' as the last 
  >3 SAME gallows, as the 3rd gallows in this 1st line has already 
  >flipped/rotated the table/key). 
  >
  >in the FOLDing scheme of things,
  >
  > i would highly suspect that these 
  >last 3,4 SAME gallows are within a NUMBERS (as opposed to alphebetic) 
  >area/TABLE at this point of decoding.
  >
  >while my previous a.b.c-1.2.3 #### posting had 'everybody in order', 
  >it may well be that
  >
  >123
  >456
  >789 
  >
  >follows the same FOLDing scheme as its gallows counterpart to 
  >
  >312
  >498
  >657 
  >
  >sorry i don't know for sure, BUT it is interesting the the 4 is static 
  >in both this positions AND that is the SAME as the gallow_char.
  >
  >-=se=-
  >steve (#'s 4 in there somewhere?) ekwall
  >
  >
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  = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
  	
  Regards,		
  jan
  
  
  
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