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Re: VMs: Cat and Mouse or Tiger and Sable?



Hi
 
I ll offer the cat and mouse and tiger and sable option. I basically think that Dana is right: WMV at a first stage saw the Irkutsk heraldry as a prisoner, then later on chose as a bookdealer an almost identical  piece ( Sessa family of course cannot originate from Irkutsk I here was joking ) ; the main point is perhaps probably for some good reason and the next question is which one.
 
I consider that Nick's answer for the latter is very convincing as a whole. VMW is mister cat, and mice are I would say at least good (books... ) bargains.
 
Mr Edgell at the moment is almost a ghost. There is an other reference to him:
 
http://www.google.fr/search?q=cache:6MOATlEo4FIJ:www.geocities.com/voyms/cat24.htm+voynich+edgell&hl=fr
 
but I am afraid unless of a good surprise in Garland papers it is about the same one in fact.
 
Back to heraldry as already pointed out before me by Rafal
 
hum.amu.edu.pl/~rafalp/HERM/VMS/biografie-old.html
 
Habdank is the name of another piece which is not rare in Poland ; here is an example:
 
http://www.freecoatsofarms.com/coatsofarms/catalogdata/556.html
 
The W which is a peculiarity of it perfectly fits with our man would he be Wilfrid, Wilfred, Wilfryd...
 
Finally it seems that the Woynicz ( otherwise Wojnicz or even Voinicius ) family members were once among those authorized to use coat of arms Nalecz:
 
 http://genealog.home.pl/g.pl?kd=4&hb=0078
 
Not that simple of course, nor certainly complete and accurate and very possibly unimportant but you know, this is why we are still voyniching.
 
IMHO: yes we have to dig in WMVs Russian youth and yes we must consider his British career from the beginning.
 
Jean

 



----- Original Message -----
From: "Nick Pelling"
To:
Sent: Monday, August 09, 2004 12:55 AM
Subject: Re: VMs: Cat and Mouse or Tiger and Sable


> Hi everyone,
>
> Thanks Dana for the Irkutsk connection - all the same, perhaps I've got it
> wrong but surely it would be just a little strange for a revolutionary to
> want to deliberately associate himself with civic heraldry of the Russian
> empire? Something to think about... :-)
>
> At 22:53 08/08/2004 +0200, Jean-Yves Artero wrote:
> >This is interesting, perhaps Sessa s family was originating from Irkutsk?
> >Many thanks for this.
>
> All the pages put the earliest known date for the Irkutsk heraldry as
> 1790,
> which is some 300 years too late for I! BS. OK, it's possible but... not
> very
> probable. :-/
>
> I suspect the real answers may lie with WMV's lost partner, Mr Edgell...
> but that's another story. :-)
>
> Cheers, .....Nick Pelling.....
>


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