Re: VMs: What do you think about Eight?

[Pamela Richards <spirlhelix@xxxxxxxxx>]

Hi, Jeff!

So, what does 45 mean; what does it portend?  Just
wondered if you had a theory for us.

Warmly,

Pam

--- Jeff <jeff@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> 360 / 8 = 45
>
http://www.seps.org/oracle/oracle.archive/Earth_Science.Astronomy/2000.12/00
> 0975206635.29091.html
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pamela Richards" <spirlhelix@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <vms-list@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: 24 August 2004 20:28
> Subject: Re: VMs: What do you think about Eight?
> 
> 
> > Hi, Nick
> >
> > The divisions of a solar year into eight may seem
> > logical, but they are only used in the Aztec,
> perhaps
> > Chinese, and Japanese calendar systems as far as I
> > know to date.
> >
> > Stretching a little to find a division by eight,
> > Saturn completes a zodiac cycle in just over
> thirty
> > years, Jupiter in around twelve, Mars in two, Sun
> one
> > of course, Venus, Mercury, and Moon in time
> periods of
> > less than a year.  But nothing comes to a division
> of
> > a solar year by eight.
> >
> > Farmers used the Moon, and still do, for
> agriculture.
> > Any activity that involves rapid change (such as
> > growth of plant life or gestation, in fact) is
> ruled
> > by the Moon.  In the face of generations of tried
> and
> > true lunar agriculture, the liklihood of
> introducing
> > to a European both a convincing new system of
> > astrological agriculture based on the sun, and
> > simultaneously a new division of the year into
> eight
> > solar periods devoid of cosmological signifcance
> seems
> > very low.
> >
> > I was hoping to find a reference to eight in the
> > Egyptian calendar, since we know RII was
> interested in
> > Egyptology, but from everything I can find it
> seems to
> >  be built solidly on the system of twelve (lunar)
> > months; and that is probably where our own
> > astrological calendar originates.  It is true that
> the
> > Egyptian agricultural calendar has a keen interest
> in
> > the Sun, as it the season of the year is
> determined by
> > the heliacal rising and setting of various fixed
> stars
> > throughout the year.  Particular attention is paid
> to
> > Sirius, whose helical rising ushers in the summer
> > season and the flooding of the Nile.
> >
> > It does intrigue me, though, that the Aztecs used
> > divisions of their calendar by eight, and that the
> > author of the VMs went to the trouble of
> attempting to
> > show the corrlation between the 360 degrees
> divided by
> > 12 and 8.  It seemingly has some importance to his
> > discourse, if we can think of it as that.
> >
> > The Sun was the most improtant figure in Aztec
> > cosmology.  They believe that our current Sun is
> the
> > fifth and final one of the existence of the world.
> > The figure in the center of their calendar was
> thought
> > to represent their Sun god.
> >
> > We don't usually see suns in the center of
> > astrological charts in Western astrology.  Most
> > hand-drawn charts of this period are square; much
> > easier to construct by hand than is a circle.  In
> the
> > center of the square we usually find some
> astrological
> > information, like the location, date and time of
> the
> > chart.  Our traditional astrology is based on
> > geocentric concpets, so even if we described the
> VMs
> > sun-centered charts as cosmolgical rather than
> > astrological, to put the Sun in the center of the
> > chart would not mean the same thing to someone of
> that
> > time period as it does to us today.  It's a
> > nonsequitur.
> >
> > The Sun is very prominent in the center of the
> > circular Aztec calndar, however.
> >
> > Warmly,
> >
> > Pam
> >
> > --- Nick Pelling <nickpelling@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > Dividing years into eight does seem one logical
> step
> > > further on from
> > > dividing years into four seasons - yet (as you
> say)
> > > there is precious
> > > little astrological practice I've found that
> views
> > > that division as either
> > > useful or practical.
> > >
> > > FWIW, my best guess would be that an eight-part
> year
> > > would most likely be
> > > an agricultural calendar, and that (as David
> Juste
> > > suggested) the diagram
> > > helps to convert between the two systems. What
> is
> > > also interesting about
> > > f67r2 is that (following recent discussions
> here) it
> > > was probably the very
> > > first folio in Quire 9. So, given that the page
> > > seems to be preceded by
> > > plants and followed by astronomy, I would be
> > > unsurprised if it turns out to
> > > act as a kind of conceptual bridge between these
> two
> > > sections - ie, to
> > > convert between a 8-period (agricultural) year
> and a
> > > 12-month
> > > (astronomical/astrological) year.
> > >
> > > f67v2 (the next page along) also seems to have a
> > > combination of plants and
> > > 8-period seasons - while f67v1 is misbound &
> should
> > > actually be at the end
> > > of the quire.
> > >
> > > f68r1 has 29 stars (all named), while f68r2 has
> 24
> > > named stars, 12 loose
> > > stars, and 23 decorative stars (the circular
> outside
> > > row): f68r3 (the
> > > "Pleiades" page, discussed fairly recently) has
> an
> > > eight-fold division,
> > > though four may be just decorative), as does
> f68v3
> > > (the "spiral galaxy"
> > > page, with the wolkenband around it). f68v2
> looks to
> > > be in eight sections,
> > > but (again) four may be decorative.
> > >
> > > But here's the clincher as to what's going on (I
> > > think): f67r1's "moon"
> > > page clearly matches f68v1's "sun" page in
> style,
> > > and (from the
> > > folding/binding discussion and design) we know
> that
> > > these two should
> > > actually be beside each other. But the moon
> diagram
> > > is divided into *12*
> > > (or 24), while the sun diagram is divided into
> *16*
> > > (or 32)!
> > >
> > > Putting it all together, I think that we have
> two
> > > separate kinds of
> > > astronomical calendar being referred to: (1)
> f67r1's
> > > lunar-based calendar
> > > (probably based on the lunar month), and (2)
> f68v1's
> > > solar-based calendar
> > > (probably based on the four seasons), and where
> > > f67r2 shows how to convert
> 
=== message truncated ===


=====
"I'd rather learn from one bird how to sing, than to teach ten thousand stars how not to dance."


		
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